What is it about traction control that polarizes the motorsport community so much?? I never used to pay attention about the traction control controveersy that was boiling up in auto racing. This year it has become a contentious matter in World Superbikes where Ducati is using its super expensive traction control from MotoGP. latest estimates say that a remotely competetive traction control in World Superbikes will cost half a million dollar per rider per annum. My understanding is that traction control limits wheelspin and thus improves traction. Are there any other ways thru which traction control can generate traction?? Yea I know the definition of traction control is debatable too. Some say u need a stand alone black box and others say u can tune in a degree of traction control in engine mapping.

I want this to be a superthread concerning traction control in motorsports. So everybody's thoughts are invited

Traction control, while a good thing for the most part, is boring! It is safer though and will prevent a lot of accidents on the street and crashes on the track

Monkeyfkker since you r a drag racing nut i thought abt asking u. Do top level pro drag racing like Top Fuel and Funny Car use traction control??

No, none. They control traction through the clutch. There's nothing like watching a 7000 horsepower Top Fuel rail losing traction at the 60 foot mark. They go up in smoke more than Cheech & Chong!! lol

I don't understand why bikes are using traction control now. I mean, that's pretty lame. Have the bikes gotten so fast that they really need something like that?

i'm sure the higher-ups eventually in every motorsport will cap traction control to a certain extent. if they don't, at some point teams will be racing with no drivers. it'll just be an empty-seated program that races the cars. things like ABS and traction control in motorsports is like using steroids in man-sports, or maphacks in computer games.

but yes of course, traction control, ABS, and all of that mumbo jumbo should definitely be used in all commercial cars. just not motorsports.

What is per annum ? I forgotten...sorry...anyone plz tell me what is Per Annum...per year is it ?

So I take it the money, power, and sex thing was just a gimmick?

Damnit.

What is per annum ? I forgotten...sorry...anyone plz tell me what is Per Annum...per year is it ?

yaps per year it is

i think personally all motorsports should have no driver aids, i know it makes it safer and for that reason it will never happen but it takes the "driving" out of it, everything is controlled by computers, its all good if u are an amateur on a track but the pro's should be able to cope without it

i think personally all motorsports should have no driver aids, i know it makes it safer and for that reason it will never happen but it takes the "driving" out of it,....
Be careful what you wish for.
You'll be pushing that Big Wheel around the track with no "driver aids".

Good traction control systems are great.
Mediocre/poor traction control systems should be turned off.
I would like the RaceLogic system on mine some day, but I don't know if I'll cough up the bucks.

Yeah man, no power steering SUCKS. I've never tried anything without power brakes but that's gotta suck too.

I only came into this thread because it said Sex in the title.

Anyway, what monkey said: it's boring. Day to day, it's very nice in the wet, but on the track it starts taking the skill component and replacing it with technology, ie Formula 1.

And how the hell does TC work on a bike?

TC is just a throttle limiter. It doesn't matter how many wheels you have.

I believe after years and years of research on how to get more traction to the ground on a sports bike, Ducati has finally come up with a viable solution that is quite obvious to the common man

http://oregonstate.edu/~reedth/smart-bike.jpg

USE FOUR WHEELS! Bikes are ******ed. There is a reason why cars have 4 wheels. This is a sports CAR forum anyway, so I just thought I'd add this awesome 30 second photoshop in for shats and giggles.

^^^LOL trying to be witty ehh?? Well the thread is about traction control in general in motorsports- not about bikes

As long as it can be completely turned off or on I don't think it should bother anyone.

It seems those poop-deck-dwellers who put unbeatable TC systems in the cars kind of make things terribly annoying for enthusiasts though.

What's worse though I think is the way particular cars will clamp the brakes if the situation is deemed dangerous or something. Mid corner random, uncontrollable braking must be a b*tch is Mercs when pushed hard.


TC in Motorcycle Racing is weak.

Weak.

Isn't it stability control that clamps the brakes? Not traction control.

no, that's ABS/anti lock brakes/whatever.

Traction control is quite annoying if it's very 'present'.

No, I mean when you take a fast corner and the car detects that it is over or under steering and the stability control system clamps some brakes to straighten out the car. Right?
I don't mean ABS.

i think that traction control really isnt that important.. i honestly would like to have it.. just to make sure i dont wag the tail like crazy.. but most traction control can be turned off...so its ok...

As long as it can be completely turned off or on I don't think it should bother anyone.

It seems those poop-deck-dwellers who put unbeatable TC systems in the cars kind of make things terribly annoying for enthusiasts though.

What's worse though I think is the way particular cars will clamp the brakes if the situation is deemed dangerous or something. Mid corner random, uncontrollable braking must be a b*tch is Mercs when pushed hard.


TC in Motorcycle Racing is weak.

Weak.

Well Troy Corser was saying that fellow aussie Troy Bayliss was getting on the throttle mid corner leaned over on his Ducati. He added that if he tried the same thing he wud be up in the air and then in the gravel. Sounds like a quite capable traction control to me

Of course this is only the fourth year that electronic systems like TC are being used in four-stroke motorcycle racing. The problem is bike racers are known to use wheel spin to get the drive out of corners. So the onus on the engineers is to differntiate good wheelspin from bad.

Of course F1 has a near two decade experience with traction control So they are quite advanced compared to the bike guyz but the MotoGP boyz are getting there.

I believe after years and years of research on how to get more traction to the ground on a sports bike, Ducati has finally come up with a viable solution that is quite obvious to the common man

http://oregonstate.edu/~reedth/smart-bike.jpg

USE FOUR WHEELS! Bikes are ******ed. There is a reason why cars have 4 wheels. This is a sports CAR forum anyway, so I just thought I'd add this awesome 30 second photoshop in for shats and giggles.


I think I laughed out-loud when I saw this.

The future face of bike racing:rolleyes:

.........
Of course F1 has a near two decade experience with traction control So they are quite advanced compared to the bike guyz but the MotoGP boyz are getting there.

And since they only have 2 wheels to focus on they will get there twice as fast :p

Honestly, I prefer my equipment withut too much of electronics interfering with my will. Traction control is like safe sex. As long as you use it you're safe, if you decide to be a real man the **** hits the fan faster before youre done analysing the word 'macho'

what about wrc?? how big an influence tc has on that sport??

what about wrc?? how big an influence tc has on that sport??

I think the difference is determined by the quality of the track.

not many are participating in this thread too sad

That would mainly be because I never had extensive knowledge of electronics also limiting my practical application of electronics to motor management and keepping my fingers off of anything else.

I guess you found a part of automotive technology I don't have knowledge of :D

:-k might be something I should learn about then

and aslo inform us about as you get to know the new stuffs along the way

Except for a totally factory prawned driver; real race drivers almost never (maybe in the wet) use ABS. At-the-limit braking is part of their JOB. Their reaction times and experience exceed the parameters of some damn computer program. They may want to lock a wheel momentarily to induce a desired response in the car.

On a road/track that a driver is familiar with; one knows where water flows/stands. A computer doesn't.

Did somebody mention Rally? Blasting dirt/gravel airborne in extreme oversteer is like a rocket's reaction mass thrust. Would you want a 'puter limiting slip at that moment? Braking or getting sideways on loose surface reduces speed by displacing/plowing surface media.

I might not desire to go off pavement in a given car; but it WILL have an ABS/traction control disabling switch... , or I WILL disable it with an installed switch/pulled fuse.

I am the driver. I will make the decision.

Except for a totally factory prawned driver; real race drivers almost never (maybe in the wet) use ABS. At-the-limit braking is part of their JOB. Their reaction times and experience exceed the parameters of some damn computer program. They may want to lock a wheel momentarily to induce a desired response in the car.

On a road/track that a driver is familiar with; one knows where water flows/stands. A computer doesn't.

Did somebody mention Rally? Blasting dirt/gravel airborne in extreme oversteer is like a rocket's reaction mass thrust. Would you want a 'puter limiting slip at that moment? Braking or getting sideways on loose surface reduces speed by displacing/plowing surface media.

I might not desire to go off pavement in a given car; but it WILL have an ABS/traction control disabling switch... , or I WILL disable it with an installed switch/pulled fuse.

I am the driver. I will make the decision.You are absolutely right Steve, in rally more than anywhere else (except maybe ice racing) you want to lock your wheels when braking on loose surfaces in order to throw your car in the turn, same thing with wheelspin ! No traction control or ABS in racing, thank you...;)

I should add that the same applies in deep or unpacked snow. You slow down by plowing/bulldozing loose media mass forward/sideways. ABS is a handicap.

On glare/black ice; you are screwed. With/without ABS, that tree/ditch/cliff has your name on it.

Actually rally cars have both "traction control" and ABS, the traction control on rally cars only affects the differential (no idea how this would work) its not like a normal traction control, yet it does traction controling ....anyways and a light form of ABs is also present in wrc cars, most of the side turning done by the cars is because of the hydrolic e brake provided in the cars.