as you can see on the official website, TCS will be illegal in 2008
http://www.formula1.com/news/5857.html

personally I like that decision
It'll make more important the car and not the electronics:)

I'm surprised..but if it makes racing better, then it's okay with me.

Already been posted. IMO, will make racing much better, more driver orientated, and closer racing. Hopefully this will play into the hands of JB because he's a very very smooth driver.

Mmmmmmm, might be a good decision but I doubt it, if you look at F1 now if you see that back kicking out sometimes. It might even slow down F1

Hmmm, sounds like a good idea. It should make F1 more fun, exciting and like bennyboy said, more driver orientated. I can't wait to see some good drifting/over steering action from the less experienced drives!:D lol

it's just getting stupid now... next they'll have 3 gears, drum brakes and no downforce applications.. just like back in 1950. man...

it's just getting stupid now... next they'll have 3 gears, drum brakes and no downforce applications.. just like back in 1950. man...

What the? Please tell me how no TC is a bad thing? Also, how does the banning of one technology bring you to doomsday scenarios?

What the? Please tell me how no TC is a bad thing? Also, how does the banning of one technology bring you to doomsday scenarios?

i, along with most people, believe F1 racing should be getting more-and-more technology based, not less and less... seriously, it's not long before LMP's will be faster around tracks than F1 cars. don't you think it should be getting more technology-based, not less...?

EDIT: btw, i love your sig, did you make that in paint yourself?

I think it's a good step for F1. People have less respect for drivers that have to drive with traction control. TC banished FTW!!!!!111

i, along with most people, believe F1 racing should be getting more-and-more technology based, not less and less... seriously, it's not long before LMP's will be faster around tracks than F1 cars. don't you think it should be getting more technology-based, not less...?

EDIT: btw, i love your sig, did you make that in paint yourself?

F1 is inevitably going to be a toss-up between technology and river skill. TC, as it is now, has become such an intergrated part of the cars that they are taking too much away from the drivers.

Taking from what Barichello has said in the past about he differences between Ferrari's and Honda TC, he said that the Ferrari TC was so good that coming out of a corner all you needed to do was plant the throttle and the TC would do the rest for you.

If you add more and more tech to the cars, such as Tc and even Stab control, how much of the car is down to the driver? The human aspects of racing, a major part of what makes racing great, would be diminished to the point whereby driver's wouldn't be seen as the daredevils who risk their lives for the joy of driving who we admire. Besides, I don't see how I can get excited if Tc and Stab comes into F1 and I know that the driver relying on his cars electronic systems in order to go around the corner without oversteering. I want to be able to tell the great drivers from the bad by how they are able to control their cars, how they are able to milk every bit of speed out fo their car by staying on the limit of adhesion.

The more tech you put in, the less the driver has to do. Remember that this is still a drivers championship as well as a constructors, and I felt that TC was taking too much away from making good racing. Sure you can still have incredible tech in the sport, but from an average viewer's point of view, what matters is the racing. Your average Joe on the street doesn't care whether the cars run TC or not anyway.

I don't see how getting rid of TC will make them slow at all. It's is hard to compare times from TC days and 'apparent' non TC days, due to the reg changes and the large advances in all aspects of design. However, if we take a time from Melbourne in 1999, the fastest lap was a 1:32.112 by Schuamcher. This year the fastest was a 1:25.1 by Raikkonen. 7 seconds that may be, if you take into account the huge developments in aero, gearbox, tyres and all that, the gap would most certainly go down. he absence of TC ain't going to add 7 seconds onto the times.

My sig, you mean my DA account? Yeah I did all that by myself in MSPaint, tho I've been slacking off recently :/

i didnt know that they used traction control, because they didnt act like it, its good, as long as the crashes wont happen more and it makes it more fun, it should be cool...and im not a F1 nut guy so dont flame at me about essays of how F1 DCS works...

I think it's cool. I hate modern technology in cars. But it's not like it's going to make it safer, but it will definitely make it cooler!

Yeah, it would definitely make F1 more cooler because you will see more drifting/sideways action = fun and excitement!:p

But i'm not that sure about safety becuase a driver could spin out onto the middle of the track and then cause havoc which could turn into a multi-car pile up!:D

Glad they made the decision. now for some real racing....

Finally traction control is finally banned!

Just like the good old days.

i willl make he starts more interesting than they already are

i didnt know that they used traction control, because they didnt act like it, its good, as long as the crashes wont happen more and it makes it more fun, it should be cool...and im not a F1 nut guy so dont flame at me about essays of how F1 DCS works...

It's more noticeable in real life. It's actually quite loud, much much louder than what you get on TV, so if no one tells you, it's not exactly easy to tell that they use it anyway :)

BTW, what's DCS?

some sort of name for Traction control, BMW call it DSC so on and so on

it isnt DCS though i think

Great, but I doubt it will work.
Everybody will start accusing everybody that they will have some sort of secret tc system in their car. The FIA can't find it, and will end up allowing tc again....

true cause the same thing happend last year with the supposed flexi rear wing and this year everyone has a device which stops that from happening

Great, but I doubt it will work.
Everybody will start accusing everybody that they will have some sort of secret tc system in their car. The FIA can't find it, and will end up allowing tc again....

Teams are using standardised ECUs from next season onwards (from everyone's favourite software company Microsoft, apparently), so the FIA reckon they can then successfully police the use of illegal TC systems.

I think it's a good step for F1. People have less respect for drivers that have to drive with traction control. TC banished FTW!!!!!111

Precisely. The drivers are getting less and less recognised as the driving force of a team, and it's basically becoming the car. Banning TC will put the drivers in the spotlight once again, and make them concentrate harder, fight more for positions, etc. which makes for great racing.

.Taking from what Barichello has said in the past about he differences between Ferrari's and Honda TC, he said that the Ferrari TC was so good that coming out of a corner all you needed to do was plant the throttle and the TC would do the rest for you.

If you add more and more tech to the cars, such as Tc and even Stab control, how much of the car is down to the driver? The human aspects of racing, a major part of what makes racing great, would be diminished to the point whereby driver's wouldn't be seen as the daredevils who risk their lives for the joy of driving who we admire. Besides, I don't see how I can get excited if Tc and Stab comes into F1 and I know that the driver relying on his cars electronic systems in order to go around the corner without oversteering. I want to be able to tell the great drivers from the bad by how they are able to control their cars, how they are able to milk every bit of speed out fo their car by staying on the limit of adhesion.

That's why Barrichello was so slow for Honda at the start of 2006, he couldn't get used to the traction control system, and he kept missing his braking points, and the brakes weren't working for him, but then Honda found a new material for him and he was on the pace.

But I believe TC is one of the things which makes Ferrari so successful. If the driver doesn't have as much to do as he would in other cars, the car's going to be more settled and become faster. I also believe that's why Massa was so quick in the Ferrari from BMW Sauber; he got used to the car's TC system and it was easy to use, so he became quite quick.

If the TC system is banned, maybe Ferrari will become slower round the corners, and their car won't be as useable? Have to wait and see.

i didnt know that they used traction control, because they didnt act like it, its good, as long as the crashes wont happen more and it makes it more fun, it should be cool...and im not a F1 nut guy so dont flame at me about essays of how F1 DCS works...

There isn't really a name for traction control in F1. There's no fancy names and crap which car manufacturers put in there, I just think it's called 'Traction Control'. But hey, it's being gotten rid of, which is good.

Teams are using standardised ECUs from next season onwards (from everyone's favourite software company Microsoft, apparently), so the FIA reckon they can then successfully police the use of illegal TC systems.

Yes. The ECUs are from Microsoft, and I reckon the FIA will do a good job of hunting down illegal TC systems. They seem to be very very good at penalising people for the smallest of things, so I don't think it will be that hard to find an illegal system.

That said, I do believe that there will be a few niggles and loopholes that teams will take advantage of. I reckon in the next few years there will be an investigation into a few systems which teams have used. The FIA will then close those loopholes and make the rules crystal clear so there's no 'cheating' or mysterious goings on.

I think this may be a safety issue.

I don't like the idea of no TC. Really, if an F1 driver is better without it, the F1 team shouldn't bother putting one on.

What a driver is supposed to do is maximize the potential of the car with the tools he's given with. If I wanted to see "raw" racing, I'd watch go-kart racing.



But I believe TC is one of the things which makes Ferrari so successful. If the driver doesn't have as much to do as he would in other cars, the car's going to be more settled and become faster. I also believe that's why Massa was so quick in the Ferrari from BMW Sauber; he got used to the car's TC system and it was easy to use, so he became quite quick.

I recall Schumacher and Barichello having a complete opposite adjustment in brake and throttle pedal throw. Even with TC, Schumacher was still able to modulate acceleration with vastly long pedal throw to gain extra tenths on a lap. Was there driver skill involved with that? Yes. Just, Schumacher was able to get the most out of it, instead of Barichello using it as an on/off switch on very short pedal throw.

i think this is a good thing... like it was mentioned earlier, it focuses more on the driver...

it might give the under-dog teams and advantage too... cocky drivers might end up spinning out and the under-dogs come through and win the race...

Does this mean the E-diff disappears too?

That is a form of traction control.

Alot more people are going to die in flaming fireballs now.

This will make F1 more exciting, but will make the races slower and could make the sport a lot more dangerous. Sure, there are a lot of driver aids these days, but you still need to be incredibly skilled to drive a car like that at the limit. I believe in having restrictions to protect the drivers and make F1 a safer sport, but they are starting to ban alot of things now, and I fear that F1 will eventually no longer be the most extreme form of racing.

^If it was making cars more unsafe, the ban would have never been put in place. You know what the FIA is like.

That's a good point Bennyboy, I suppose they are hoping that drivers will be more cautious and go slower which would make accidents less dangerous should they occur, but the thing is, you don't want to make an accident in the first place, and no TC might make them more frequent.

as you can see on the official website, TCS will be illegal in 2008

We are here today to mourn the death of Formula one drivers.

Guys, you do know that the banning of traction control was not to slow F1 down, but to make the racing more driver orientated?

^^ yea.

The reason to that of banning traction control is taking the true skills out of the driver and onto the track.

Guys, you do know that the banning of traction control was not to slow F1 down, but to make the racing more driver orientated?

I never would have thought that the banning of TC would be held in such contempt by most people here, and it seems that most of them haven't seen anything F1 past 2000. Benny's posts hits the nail on the head for the reasons why TC is being banned, and i thought it was bloody obvious!

If the sole reason for using TC was to make racing safer, then why isn't a universal feature in every racing series?

GT3, you say a driver is supposed to maximise the car with the tools he is given, yet how does that change without TC? Wouldn;t having no TC allow drivers to maximise their cars even more considering they have no TC to rely on?

We all know that the FIA of late have been, quite frankly, safety nuts, but what they've done in that aspect has been great, at least drivers aren;t dying, or at least getting serverly/fatally injured. However, called the banning of TC a safety thing seems to be a bit optimistic, seeing as though F1 could potentially be more dangerous with it, given the fact that there is more risk of losing it without having a system to prevent you from losing it.

I never would have thought that the banning of TC would be held in such contempt by most people here, and it seems that most of them haven't seen anything F1 past 2000. Benny's posts hits the nail on the head for the reasons why TC is being banned, and i thought it was bloody obvious!

If the sole reason for using TC was to make racing safer, then why isn't a universal feature in every racing series?

GT3, you say a driver is supposed to maximise the car with the tools he is given, yet how does that change without TC? Wouldn;t having no TC allow drivers to maximise their cars even more considering they have no TC to rely on?

We all know that the FIA of late have been, quite frankly, safety nuts, but what they've done in that aspect has been great, at least drivers aren;t dying, or at least getting serverly/fatally injured. However, called the banning of TC a safety thing seems to be a bit optimistic, seeing as though F1 could potentially be more dangerous with it, given the fact that there is more risk of losing it without having a system to prevent you from losing it.

I thought it was pretty obvious too. Then a few people stated that it was to slow down the F1 cars? Trust me, there are a lot more ways to slow a car down, and once which are simpler than banning traction control! Thanks anyway. :)

And yes, if it was for safety, it would be seen in V8 Supercars, WTCC. BTCC, Champ Cars, etc.

And about the FIA; yes, we still have fast and tight racing, but there have been less injuries and crashes of late. I think the FIA are doing a little better a job than I would have expected them to to be honest. It's all going quite well.

^^ Having TC banned is a good thing. This actually allows drivers to give out their true potentials rather than having to rely on a traction control.

It would be even better with out TC. Drivers would spin out at the start if they overpower the car, which would be much more interesting.

GT3, you say a driver is supposed to maximise the car with the tools he is given, yet how does that change without TC? Wouldn;t having no TC allow drivers to maximise their cars even more considering they have no TC to rely on?

This is how it changes. You can vary TC control settings. No traction control to rely on does give drivers more flexibility, but it takes away a key tool for quick laps. Weather changes. TC doesn't drive the car for them, and from what I recall, some F1 drivers have issues just managing their driving style w/TC. It's a challenge for them that can help or hinder their lap times.

I mean if we really want to make it challenging, why don't F1 drivers go back to using a real manual tranny? While we're at it, let's take out the e-differential, adjustable fuel load, launch control, and other devices on F1 cars to really make it all on the driver.

I'm in it for the technological race as well as the driver's race. I love how the 750bhp cars are less than a second off from the 900+bhp V10s from 2 years ago pending track.

I remember watching Schumacher last year, adjusting his car mid-race, changing differential settings and brake bias, just to stay ahead of the competition and hang with the top drivers. Guys like Raikkonen don't really seem to need it, but in the end, both drivers were able to get the best of their cars, doing so in different ways. I can truly appreciate that.

And yes, if it was for safety, it would be seen in V8 Supercars, WTCC. BTCC, Champ Cars, etc.

I disagree. F1 tracks tend to be the most challenging, requiring the most out of a driver in terms of accleration load, braking load, and lateral g-force. Power to weight is on a different plane. Outside of Champ cars, indy cars, and go karts, other forms of racing have larger forms of protection in cars that don't nearly accelerate as quickly or achieve such a high speed.

mmm, this is interesting. I wonder how it will effect the racing? like, how much did the dirvers rely on that system, and did that system have any problems (failures, applying too much or too little braking, ect)?

mmm, this is interesting. I wonder how it will effect the racing? like, how much did the dirvers rely on that system, and did that system have any problems (failures, applying too much or too little braking, ect)?

I'd say drivers depend on traction control a hell of a lot. Even the smooth drivers do. When the cars accelerate out of corners you can hear the system buzzing and fuzzing away, trying to prevent the wheels from spinning under all the power. You can see drivers depends on it loads because on ITVs coverage of the races, the FIA has put a series of graphics on the screen. When we have an in-car shot, the revs, speed, lateral G forces, whether the driver is accelerating or braking, and the traction control usage are all shown on screen. Nearly on every single corner you can see a little graphic with 'TC' on it flash continuously orange to show the TC usage.

I think drivers will have to adjust their driving styles a bit to cope with the loss of traction control.

frewin 1987 paces the field in historical ignorance.

A decade or so ago, F1 cars had not only traction control; but launch control, active suspensions, and microwave burst/laser uplink/downlink past the pits. The team with the best 'puter nerds could analyze data from 1 past lap and reprogram/upload timing, fuel, and suspension settings for the next lap. Cars had auto downshift under braking. All the driver did was gas, steer, upshift, and brake. Had this continued unchecked; there would have soon been autopilots subject to driver override. FIA rightly (for once) said ENOUGH!

They tried to ban traction control a few years ago but had no way of enforcing it. With a spec ECM they will be able to do so. If the driver's foot is too heavy; the smoke/spin will be quick.

V8 Supercars use spec ECM's and no TC and the racing is great!

Rolex Grand Am has spec ECM and no TC this year and the racing is great!

NASCAR drivers say, "What the hell is traction control?". The racing is great!

Get over it!

Calm guys will win; leadfoots will lose...

frewin 1987 paces the field in historical ignorance.

A decade or so ago, F1 cars had not only traction control; but launch control, active suspensions, and microwave burst/laser uplink/downlink past the pits. The team with the best 'puter nerds could analyze data from 1 past lap and reprogram/upload timing, fuel, and suspension settings for the next lap. Cars had auto downshift under braking. All the driver did was gas, steer, upshift, and brake. Had this continued unchecked; there would have soon been autopilots subject to driver override. FIA rightly (for once) said ENOUGH!

They tried to ban traction control a few years ago but had no way of enforcing it. With a spec ECM they will be able to do so. If the driver's foot is too heavy; the smoke/spin will be quick.

NASCAR drivers say, "What the hell is traction control?". The racing is great!

LOL!!! (Yes, I mean it)

Thanks for the info, steve. I never knew such ...automated devices were ever used in F1. The idea of auto downshifting absolutely pisses me off.....

1 race in and I already think F1 racing is great.

I think it's one thing if something automates the experience for the driver. Auto downshifting? Please.

I think it's another thing if a team can produce a tool e.g. traction control variance, fuel load, electronic brake distribution, differential setting to create consistent laps over the duration of a race.

LOL!!! (Yes, I mean it)

Thanks for the info, steve. I never knew such ...automated devices were ever used in F1. The idea of auto downshifting absolutely pisses me off.....
there is no way on earth that f1 is using auto downshifting.

well without those traction grips i think we might have more F1 cars crash fly into the gravel and crash into the side walls. lol. anyways I also like this decision, probably we'll get more F1's drfting along... lol. :D

TC forbidden for the formula cars?.>I agree with this decision to ban TC because for now and then we will see more drifting from the drivers.But this will make them slower than first.TC helps for fast laps.I HOPE TO SEE THAT...

This is gonna' get interesting....especially in the wet...

In the wet the drivers gonna have a lot of sideways.And this means enthusiasm for the crowd or for those who watch F1

I disagree. F1 tracks tend to be the most challenging, requiring the most out of a driver in terms of accleration load, braking load, and lateral g-force. Power to weight is on a different plane. Outside of Champ cars, indy cars, and go karts, other forms of racing have larger forms of protection in cars that don't nearly accelerate as quickly or achieve such a high speed.
F1 tracks seem relatively easy compared to some other tracks. Laguna Seca, Mount Panorama, Nurburgring and such equal or exceed the difficulty of F1 tracks.

I'm all for the banning of traction control. Drivers make mistakes, computers don't. Mistakes make racing more interesting.

Too all the people saying that all the drivers will end up dead you should look back at the older cars from 30s. Those things were as fast in a straight line as 350Z except it had few centermeter wide tires and drum breaks with no seat blets or any type of roll bar.Those drivers survived alright on tracks with much less run off.

well without those traction grips i think we might have more F1 cars crash fly into the gravel and crash into the side walls. lol. anyways I also like this decision, probably we'll get more F1's drfting along... lol. :D

I don't think it will increase the amount of crashes we have. The drivers will adapt. Yes, there will be a few spins, but no serious accidents or deaths, I don't think.

TC forbidden for the formula cars?.>I agree with this decision to ban TC because for now and then we will see more drifting from the drivers.But this will make them slower than first.TC helps for fast laps.I HOPE TO SEE THAT...

In 2006 when 3.0 V10 engines were replaced by 2.4 V8 engines, people predicted a lap time loss of around 5 seconds. In fact, lap times on some occasions were around 0.3 seconds quicker with the V8s than they were with the V10s. I don't think that there will be a great loss in lap times.

F1 tracks seem relatively easy compared to some other tracks. Laguna Seca, Mount Panorama, Nurburgring and such equal or exceed the difficulty of F1 tracks.

The reason why it seems so easy is because it's a safety issue.

I can't remember if it was F1, champ car, IRL, or something similar, but one of the "winged car" groups couldn't even race a particular track because the banking was too steep and may knock a driver unconscious from the g-forces. I want to say it was Indianapolis because they wanted to add a chicane at turn 13.

There's already another thread about why F1 cars are not on Nurburgring Nordschleife and now Nick Heidfeld may drive it.

These cars put up with far heavier loads and are far more sensitive to track challenges than other cars. Precisely why they're not really at Laguna Seca and other tracks except for exhibitions.

The reason why it seems so easy is because it's a safety issue.

I can't remember if it was F1, champ car, IRL, or something similar, but one of the "winged car" groups couldn't even race a particular track because the banking was too steep and may knock a driver unconscious from the g-forces. I want to say it was Indianapolis because they wanted to add a chicane at turn 13.

There's already another thread about why F1 cars are not on Nurburgring Nordschleife and now Nick Heidfeld may drive it.

These cars put up with far heavier loads and are far more sensitive to track challenges than other cars. Precisely why they're not really at Laguna Seca and other tracks except for exhibitions.

Just because the cars (or drivers) are incapable of tackling harder circuits doesn't mean they aren't there like you said in your other post. I'm not saying the F1 tracks are easy but they aren't the hardest either.

Just because the cars (or drivers) are incapable of tackling harder circuits doesn't mean they aren't there like you said in your other post. I'm not saying the F1 tracks are easy but they aren't the hardest either.

Ah. Allow me to rephrase. F1 tracks are difficult and IMHO more so, because they allow F1 cars to reach their outermost limits in terms of lateral, acceleration, brake, and combinations inbetween of g-forces.

The same can be said of other cars for more difficult tracks, but I highly doubt they're reaching F1 speeds nor have such a narrow margin for safety.

I don't think it will increase the amount of crashes we have. The drivers will adapt. Yes, there will be a few spins, but no serious accidents or deaths, I don't think.



In 2006 when 3.0 V10 engines were replaced by 2.4 V8 engines, people predicted a lap time loss of around 5 seconds. In fact, lap times on some occasions were around 0.3 seconds quicker with the V8s than they were with the V10s. I don't think that there will be a great loss in lap times.

I didn't say that without TC would be a great loss.But we will never see best lap times.In rare situations and sometimes.Generally TC helps in a fast lap.

I didn't say that without TC would be a great loss.But we will never see best lap times.In rare situations and sometimes.Generally TC helps in a fast lap.

Yes I agree it does help with fast lap times. We'll have to see what the loss/gain (?) is in 2008.

The reason why it seems so easy is because it's a safety issue.

I can't remember if it was F1, champ car, IRL, or something similar, but one of the "winged car" groups couldn't even race a particular track because the banking was too steep and may knock a driver unconscious from the g-forces. I want to say it was Indianapolis because they wanted to add a chicane at turn 13.

There's already another thread about why F1 cars are not on Nurburgring Nordschleife and now Nick Heidfeld may drive it.

These cars put up with far heavier loads and are far more sensitive to track challenges than other cars. Precisely why they're not really at Laguna Seca and other tracks except for exhibitions.

Indianapolis 2005 or ''Indygate'' was where the chicane was going to be put in, but it was the tyres' fault (Michelin claimed the excessive loads on the tyres during the banking would cause them to explode in a matter of a flew laps.) That was the tyres fault, not the cars.

Ah. Allow me to rephrase. F1 tracks are difficult and IMHO more so, because they allow F1 cars to reach their outermost limits in terms of lateral, acceleration, brake, and combinations inbetween of g-forces.

The same can be said of other cars for more difficult tracks, but I highly doubt they're reaching F1 speeds nor have such a narrow margin for safety.
So your saying that F1 tracks are harder on F1 cars than something like Mount Panorama on a V8 Supercar?

What I'm saying is that if you had something like a Caterham and drove around the F1 course as well as the ones I mentioned the ones like the Nurburgring, Laguna Seca and Mount Panorama would be harder on both the car and the driver.

In the wet the drivers gonna have a lot of sideways.And this means enthusiasm for the crowd or for those who watch F1

yeah this would make it worth watching in a wet race

So your saying that F1 tracks are harder on F1 cars than something like Mount Panorama on a V8 Supercar?

What I'm saying is that if you had something like a Caterham and drove around the F1 course as well as the ones I mentioned the ones like the Nurburgring, Laguna Seca and Mount Panorama would be harder on both the car and the driver.

I mean to say that F1 cars have higher limits and F1 tracks allow them to reach these limits without endangering the drivers like putting F1 cars on Mount Panorama or Nurburgring Nordschliefe.

Racing is already a dangerous sport. If you had a Caterham, you're not exactly facing 3-5gs of cornering load with up to 4g braking. F1 cars are capable of that. Caterhams without serious downforce or v8 supercars aren't. F1 driving is already inherently dangerous and takes plenty of skill to handle the g-loads, with or without traction control almost irregardless of track layout. It's a lower edge limit of the car, so the challenge is on the tracks for v8 supercars and the like.

If F1 cars went to Mount Panorama, Laguna Seca, could you imagine how much more safety would be implimented into the car because of the higher limits it's able to obtain?

I'm not saying one form of racing is more dangerous than another, but rather in F1, there's plenty enough built within the car, and other forms of racing, it may be more based on track layout.

As if F1 cars in Monaco even with TC wasn't hard enough...

"Indygate" was the withdrawal of Michelin shod teams after the familiarization lap at the USGP in 2005 due to concerns about sidewall failures at nowhere near the speeds that Indycars reach in turn 1>

In April of 2001, CART cancelled a race at Texas Motor Speedway after 21 of 25 drivers complained of dizziness and disorientation after practice and qual sessions that reached speeds above 230 mph on a 1.5 mile tri-oval with 24-degree banking. Estimates were 8-9 G vertical; more than fighter pilots (bigger and reclined less than open wheel drivers) take for the same duration.

^That was the race I was thinking of. Thank you for clearing that up.

TC forbidden for the formula cars?.>I agree with this decision to ban TC because for now and then we will see more drifting from the drivers.But this will make them slower than first.TC helps for fast laps.I HOPE TO SEE THAT...
there would be no drifting even if there was no TC. The aerodynamics on the F1 cars give so much downforce it is nearly impossible for it to powerslide/drift.

there would be no drifting even if there was no TC. The aerodynamics on the F1 cars give so much downforce it is nearly impossible for it to powerslide/drift.

Aerodynamics helps a lot, if all 4 tyres are in constant contact with the track.

But you can see in Malaysia... undulating surfaces, combination of high and low speed curves, slight banks, sharp turns... even during the practice runs TC came up often. At low speeds, aerodynamics doesn't have much of an affect.

So, while there will be no real "drifting", there will be slip.

there would be no drifting even if there was no TC. The aerodynamics on the F1 cars give so much downforce it is nearly impossible for it to powerslide/drift.

Then why is still possible for cars to loose the back end in corners?

Then why is still possible for cars to loose the back end in corners?


yeah but this is most likly driver error or some sort of problem with the balence of the car

yeah but this is most likly driver error or some sort of problem with the balence of the car

But by his reasoning, he is saying that it is impossible for the car to loose grip AT ALL purely because of the current level of aerosyanmic downfore. However, cars still tend to loose their back ends in corners, meaning that that can't be true.

But by his reasoning, he is saying that it is impossible for the car to loose grip AT ALL purely because of the current level of aerosyanmic downfore. However, cars still tend to loose their back ends in corners, meaning that that can't be true.


well that is not right F1 cars can loose the back end thirough corners. teh areo downforce isn't as strong as it looks when the back end slides out

woo, why not just shoot half the F1 drivers instead

^Because that's silly.

Anyway, it is possible to have a little ''drift'' or a little slide on all four wheels. Hockenheim 2005, qualifying, Kimi Raikkonen, last corner, perfectly controlled four wheel slide at the end of that corner. Got pole after that lap. Who said sliding loses time?

^Because that's silly.

Anyway, it is possible to have a little ''drift'' or a little slide on all four wheels. Hockenheim 2005, qualifying, Kimi Raikkonen, last corner, perfectly controlled four wheel slide at the end of that corner. Got pole after that lap. Who said sliding loses time?

It's great for 1 lap. Over the course of the race? Too much tire degradation.

woo, why not just shoot half the F1 drivers instead

Just like I said before, there were times before traction control. This also happened around the same time that they had drum brakes, few inch wide tires, no roll protection or even seat belts. Drivers survived just fine.

However much you all appreciate technology; you pedestrian bois need to get a grip on reality!

There is NO downforce in a 45 mph hairpin at Monaco. In a 1400 lb car w/700 hp on a wet track; a driver who is not calm and gentle(twinkletoes?) will spin around twice.

Having a spec ECM doesn't mean spec software. I'm sure that drive-by-wire throttle software for a wet track will be slow start/fast finish.