http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/1745/europef1ag4.jpg


Sorry, just felt like getting this up early, on account of I'm eagerly waiting for this new GP. Hope no one minds

So, anyways, brand new circuit to F1, and that means anything can happen really. We don't know who the circuit will play to, Ferrari or McLaren.

So, opinions on the circuit or even predictions for quali anyone


Circuit Diagram
http://www.formula1.com/races/in_detail/europe_798/circuit_diagram.html

About Valencia
http://www.formula1.com/news/features/2008/8/8229.html

A few laps of Valencia from GT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P29gbyKKx5Q

OOOOHHHH I hope that Ferrari can have massa win this, I need at least one weekend where i am not upset.

this is going to be like another Monaco, with massive crashes, mark my words.

vamos alonso :p
I really hope we can see some competition from the Ferraris..it's about time!

I wonder if Kimi actually turns up to the race :o:(.









Yeah I'm predicting a Kimi win :p !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I hope both Ferraris perform good. In that case we will see some good fights.

Also i'm hoping for Kubica too. This guy must take some points.

Looking forward for the next week!

And Cooper's, i marked your words! :D

Ferrari better flop big style as i have confidence they will.

They might aswell keep the poor run going as its good to watch them struggling. Ferrari problems are a time to savor the moment and relish them. Massas engine blow with 3 laps left in hungary was such a great site, shame it dosen't happen more often & Kimi is driving like he aint arsed anymore.

It should be a good race but the practise sessions won't really indicate the overall pace but who has got to grips with the new track the quickest. My prediction would be (no prizes here for guessing) Lewis Hamilton as he has got the ability to do so. Also i believe the Mclarens will be strong aswell.

Toyota should do well especially Timo Glock after his 2nd place in Hingary should give him the confidence and also Kovy should do well after that well needed confidence boost in Hungary

I wouldn't actually count kovy out for this win. Apparently McLaren are using about the same set-up from germany, and we know who dominant that went. Of course they could just be blowing up smoke.

But then again, it could all depend on development that went on over the holidays. Who knows. All I know is that a dream result would come in the form of Massa 1st, Kovy second.
But personally, I think its about time that Ferrari gave Massa preference over Kimi. Massa is able to pull much more consistent grid positions, and hungary only backs up why they should favor him.
In a recent pole on, who should ferrari back, 56% went to Kimi, and that result actually favors Massa, when you consider how many supporters Kimi's grasped over, you'd think he'd have a much much bigger percentage.

Anyways, I don't believe Kimi's lost the will to fight, he just struggles with quali. Similar to the probelms Heidfeld is suffering.

This is anyones game, im looking forward to it simply because its once again into the unknown, no one has a form guide here so there is simply no clue as to who may go well here. McLaren might struggle, Ferrari might struggle, we may get BMW winning it. We simply dont know. As a track my first impressions say that this may just favour the silver cars, but its not like a normal street circuit, its wide, just with high walls, so its not going to be like Monaco. Hopefully it will be unlike Monaco and we will get some overtaking.

Set up is vital here, no one knows the right set up yet so if you can get yours spot on then you will have a better shot at it because someone who has struggled with set ups lately is Kimi, he desperately needs to get it right here or he may just find himself out of contention sooner than he thought. Hammy has a nack of learning new tracks as he showed last year, going to 4 or 5 tracks he had never been to before and getting pole and then going on to win it. He has the talent to get his groove on and win this race. Massa sometimes struggles with finding the perfect set up but he is in a better position than Kimi and will be eager to avenge his painfully unlucky engine failure in Hungary.

This is anyones game and is one of the tracks ive been waiting for this year. Wont make a prediction, but Hamilton can win this, if he gets it right. Hope he does, come on Hammy!!!

I felt in love with the track. Had to download it for RFactor. Awesome!!!! Hope to see a good race and performance by Toyota and BMW...

Dam, that circuit looks damn nice! It's a city course, right? I'm hoping for some very exciting racing and overtaking! Go Toyota, BMW, and Honda!!!.....

To be honest, it looks better on a map, than what ive seen from onboard video. Looks very bare and basic, should be better by the time the F1 crews arrive, but i think it will take a year or 2 to be fully up and running with facilities and such. It will take time to look the part.

Kubica all the way!!!!!


or Coulthard (haha who i'm i kidding!!)

I wonder if Kimi actually turns up to the race :o:(.









Yeah I'm predicting a Kimi win :p !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You need to learn to stop with your predictions Nemphis! :p

Hopefully Ferrari will get back to form this weekend. Last race was very unlucky so hopefully they will bag in some decent points to keep them back in the game.

Also it's a new track to the F1 calendar so we should expect some pretty good action on the racetrack.

You need to learn to stop with your predictions Nemphis! :p

Mate I can't help it :o.


I'm a Kimi fanboy I have to predict him, I wish I had the confidence to say he can win this race but I haven't yet I still say he will win it :confused:.

Mate I can't help it :o.


I'm a Kimi fanboy I have to predict him, I wish I had the confidence to say he can win this race but I haven't yet I still say he will win it :confused:.

MCLAREN WILL PREVIAL!

End of :D

Street Race Courses suck. Always have/always will. Monaco and Long Beach have history (tradition) cred; but ask the drivers what they think. Small errors = DNFs.

When Lewis gets the pole he often zones in/kicks butt. If he doesn't; it's anybody's race.

This is the European Gran Prix. It didn't previously score points; and it has moved often...

Street Race Courses suck. Always have/always will. Monaco and Long Beach have history (tradition) cred; but ask the drivers what they think. Small errors = DNFs.


Monaco in the rain? Never boring. The drivers love places like that because its risky.

Also, small errors meaning DNF's is a good thing, thats where real talent is highlighted and those small errors stoping you from being the best are magnified. Places like Monaco (especially in the wet) seperate the good drivers from the simply awesome drivers.

Anywho: Vettel opens up the weekend posting the quickest time in the first free practice time.

European Grand Prix free practice session 1 times

1. VETTEL Toro Rosso 1m40.496s

2. MASSA Ferrari 1m40.654s

3. HAMILTON McLaren 1m40.822s

4. BOURDAIS Toro Rosso 1m41.099s

5. KOVALAINEN McLaren 1m41.163s

6. KUBICA BMW 1m41.281s

7. RAIKKONEN Ferrari 1m41.317s

8. NAKAJIMA Williams 1m41.329s

9. ALONSO Renault 1m41.385s

10. ROSBERG Williams 1m41.706s

11. BARRICHELLO Honda 1m41.830s

12. TRULLI Toyota 1m41.930s

13. SUTIL Force India 1m41.951s

14. GLOCK Toyota 1m42.036s

15. PIQUET Renault 1m42.107s

16. HEIDFELD BMW 1m42.453s

17. BUTTON Honda 1m41.460s

18. FISICHELLA Force India 1m43.075s

19. COULTHARD Red Bull 1m43.312s

20. WEBBER Red Bull 1m43.524s

Kimi goes top in 2nd practice. But the big surprise is Jenson in 3rd!!! Alonso managed a 2nd fastest time, which when he did it was about a tenth faster than anyone but he was on a new set of softs i believe. I think this is one track where the softs have a definate advantage over the harder compound, at least thats what i got from it. The track however looked to be giving the drivers a bit of a problem, looks rather slippery, most the drivers having an off or 2 and generally struggling for rear traction in places. Should make for an interesting race.

Hamilton didnt look that quick here and i think the Ferraris definately can come away with a very strong result, Kimi needs to get his campaign going and Massa needs to avenge his DNF from Hungary. Alonso could run light into quali and get himself up the sharp end of the grid to mix it up a bit, Buttons seemingly massive pace i dont think will last, i think it was just a very light fuel load, new softs and clean air. I think his true pace is about 10th here, hopefully higher.


European Grand Prix free practice session 2 times

1. RAIKKONEN Ferrari 1m39.477s

2. ALONSO Renault 1m39.497s

3. BUTTON Honda 1m39.546s

4. MASSA Ferrari 1m39.678s

5. HAMILTON McLaren 1m39.712s

6. KOVALAINEN McLaren 1m39.954s

7. GLOCK Toyota 1m39.967s

8. KUBICA BMW 1m40.149s

9. PIQUET Renault 1m40.439s

10. FISICHELLA Force India 1m40.500s

11. WEBBER Red Bull 1m40.585s

12. ROSBERG Williams 1m40.607s

13. COULTHARD Red Bull 1m40.696s

14. NAKAJIMA Williams 1m40.742s

15. TRULLI Toyota 1m40.877s

16. VETTEL Toro Rosso 1m40.982s

17. SUTIL Force India 1m40.999s

18. HEIDFELD BMW 1m41.084s

19. BOURDAIS Toro Rosso 1m41.246s

20. BARRICHELLO Honda 1m41.377s

i was on the top gear website and they have a video of the track.

http://sundayafternoonclub.blogs.topgear.com/2008/08/22/european-gp-new-circuit/

Well, I watched the second session, so I can commentate a bit.
Really, it was a ferrari session. It was, Massa 1st, Kimi 2nd, for nearly the entire session. That was until the end. Alonso and Button pulled laps from completely nowhere, and I mean nowhere. They were sorta mid field before those laps.
It was only Kimi's last lap quali style run that pipped them.

But Valencia is a new circuit, with a very smooth surface, which suits, Williams!!! Although it doesn't show, both Nico and Nakajima were posting very fast times early on, then they were very quiet later on. In fact, the surprise is Red Bull, who spent nearly all of the session at the back.

Still, I'd say its close enough between the two teams, but Massa seems to really like this track I think, and I think the features it shares with tracks like Bahrain will play into his hands. So I'm predicting pole to lights for Massa, he deserves it after last weekend.
After that, I'll predict one McLaren, followed by Kimi in 3rd. Also, Vettel to score at least one point, after STR's great showing in practice one.

Mate I can't help it :o.


I'm a Kimi fanboy I have to predict him, I wish I had the confidence to say he can win this race but I haven't yet I still say he will win it :confused:.
+1
I'm a total Kimi Fanboy too...:p
anywho...
my predictions for the race are that it is a Ferrari 1-2..maybe Button up high, Hamilton around P5-P6....
MCLAREN WILL PREVIAL!

End of :D
Not with that spelling..
:D

Am I the only one who was thinking "WTF H4X?!?!?" when Button put his car in 3rd this afternoon???

Jenson Button: "w00t! I'm 3rd fastest this session! Go me!"
Rest of the field: "WTF H4X."
Kimi and Felipe: "Umm, we're totally the fastest here. everybody else GTFO."

Of course this isn't what they were actually thinking, but this is what I imagine that they were thinking (something along these lines)

Big surprise should be S. Vettel. This guy was awesome today. Kudos to him.

All the people wanted Alonso for a high place but he did a mistake at the curb.

So, Massa is first (he took the first place at the last secs), Hami 2nd and Kubica is third. Nice race from Kubica.

Kimi Raikonen showed an improvement in this race and he qualified 4th.
Then we have these drivers Heikki Kovalainen (5th), Sebastian Vettel (6th), Jarno Trulli (7th), Nick Heidfeld (8th), Nico Rosberg (9th) Sebastien Bourdais (10th)..


Hm the circuit seems a bit dangerous and scary with these walls. I wonder if a F1 car crash tomorrow how fast the circuit will be cleaned?

Massa was simply awesome in the first sector. His pole lap was 2 tenths faster than Hammy who did personal bests in each sector i believe. A great quali performance by Kubica aswell, as was stated Kubica should go well here because he is very good on the brakes, especially the heavy braking sections. Kimi still a good few tenths off the pace of his teammate.

Should be a good race tomorrow. Definately will be a safety car, hopefully Hamilton wont be caught up in it.

COME ON HAMMY!!!! :D

By the way, this was the first weekend ive tried the live timing screens from formula1.com. It. Is. AMAZING. I love it, some might find it boring but you can see all the sector times, personal bests, overall bests, weather reports, its great! Plus its real time so theres no lag like the ITV internet coverage.

Quite a boring starting grid really, but the track makes it look like the race will make up for it!

If Hamilton has more fuel in like the commentator suggested, then he has real chances in this grand prix!

So I'm predicting pole to lights for Massa, he deserves it after last weekend.
After that, I'll predict one McLaren, followed by Kimi in 3rd. Also, Vettel to score at least one point, after STR's great showing in practice one.

Hey, I was close enough, Massa on pole, Lewis 2nd, and Kimi, was almost 3rd. And I believe I'll be right about Vettel to, afterall he's starting 6th.
Seriously, either its the car, or Vettel has a shot at the title next year a red bull. :eek:

But I would guess that McLaren and Ferrari are about equally fueled, and as we saw last week, ferrari were still able to pull ahead in the race despite being slower in quali. Today they were faster, so if Massa takes this into the first corner, its his race to control.

Kimi's position is an interesting one, since he can take Kubica of the start, and pressure Hamiliton possibly, but then again, he might lose a posistion to Kovalinen. It'll be interesting to see him preform, but I'd still admit hes a danger man for the race win, for one reason only. Its Kimi.

Hamiliton I think actually pulled a brilliant lap. It was an enormus improvement, and for whatever reason, I feel McLaren weren't as fast here.

But Roseberg back in front at last, its been too long. Great to see Rosbery being able to expoilt some of his potenial for a change. And a mention for Truili again. The guy pulls prefect quali sessions one after another, consistently, even at a track he looked to be struggling with.

I loved the moment they went to Mark, and asked, who do you predict to be on the front row. He was like, "but, wah, I have no bloody clue" It was true, quali 1 & 2 were mad, but I guess the circuit is new, very long, and was pretty dusty. No crashed, but a safety car I think will appear on lap one, and say in for some reason now.

I thought that qualifying went alright today...

As usual, I was impressed with the pace of Jarno and Timo...
...and shocked by what happened to Coulthard and Webber

I'm content with where Alonso is. :D

I wish Hamilton was lower (below Kimi), so that there would be less pressure (on Kimi)...

Massa ran an excellent time, and he's been quick all weekend. I'm expecting him to keep up his pace, and win this one easily. There mights be challenge from Kimi and Hamilton, but if there is any, the most challenge will come from Kimi.

My theory for Kimi's lack of pace on his final lap is that when he went into the pits, he chose the hard tyres instead of the super-soft, and he was running more race fuel load than Massa, because I think that he's going to try to get into P2 or P3, and then outlast everybody....

What I'm hoping for in terms of finish is...

1. Massa
2. Raikkonen
3. Kubica
4. Kovalinen
5. Hamilton
6. Trulli

On an unrelated note, I made a tribute for Kimi, celebrating his Drivers' Championship last season
http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/mm293/SF430/KimiMotivator.jpg

I always thought Valencia was in southern Italy, but I was just watching some of the race and they said that it was Alonso's home turf...

I think the new track is the best one in the entire F1 calendar. It reminds me of the ALMS Miami track only it's even better.

This is not a race track for F1, it is boring! Monte Carlo is enough, one city race per year is ok, but this calendar with Valencia, Monaco, Singapore .... to bad

Disappointing result for Kimi, but a great result for Massa. I doubt that they'll do anything more than a fine for that incident with Sutil in the pits...

What I REALLY want to know is....is this Ferrari problem simply a one-off on all of their factory engines when they hit the second race, is it a crankshaft problem, or are Ferrari's engines simply going screwy???

Also, I really hope that all of the Ferrari pit crew that got pulled down by Kimi's mistake are OK. That guy who got a face full of Bridgestone is the one I'm most concerned about...poor guy :(

A laughably amateur race for Ferrari. Personally its impossible to think why a whole Ferrari pit team ignored the fact Sutil was coming in alongside and released their man, I'm expecting a penalty for carelessness and the fact that that pit lane is so narrow anything could've happened.

Raikonnen made another amateur mistake in jumping before the green light and in doing so put one of their guys in an appointment with the medics...the arrogance of then not even bothering to explain yourself and simply walking of uncaringly is also hard to comprehend.

Great drive by Lewis, I have high hopes for him, definitely in with a shot at the title.

Well, it seems that Ferrari isn't going well. Another engine broke up :|. Reliability issues anyone?

Great drive from Massa. He was always fast and he didn't let any chances to Hami. And he made a little mistake with Sutil at the pitlane. I hope he will not have a penalty for this.

Kubica finished at the 3rd place and he gave some smiles to the BMW team.

Good race from Trulli, Vettel and Glock. Quite impressive i would say.

And i'm sure that Alonso will not let Nakajima leave from the airport. He's still angry with him :D

*bangs head on desk repeatedly*




Why after every race weekend is becoming harder and harder to support Kimi ?????????


His heart isn't in it and frankly I won't blame Ferrari if they choose Massa over Kimi to concentrate on winning the WDC.

I genuinely thought this would be the race weekend after reading some qoutes of his on the internet he was alot more positive with the media and sounded as if he was really gonna put all heart and soul into it but once again he messed up big time ................................


On another note Kubica had another fantastic weekend by BMW standards :).

No penalty for Massa then, just a fine for 10,000 euro. Which I think is fair, considering, he did slow down for sutil. Plus alonso's thing earlier in practice was a similar issue, and he got the exact same fine, so I say its just.

But ignoring the unwanted controversy, Massa drove an exceptional race. Pole to lights just as I predicted. =) Well deserved after last weeks nightmare, and hopefully he can carry that pace to Belgium.

Speaking of Belgium. Kimi having yet another rotten weekend. Lost the position to fellow finn of the start, and then further lost out to Truili in the pits. Not a great weekend to say the least. Then to add insult to injury, his engine blew. I'm sure it can be fixed, but if not, I believe its a 10 place penalty next week. Seriously, its high time Ferrari back Massa, give him the lighter fuel load for pole, and allow him to take another chunk of Lewis' lead.
But Imagine Massa breaking Kimi's string of Belgian wins. That would be a serious blow, and Massa's no slouch at Spa either.

Kubica, you have to hand it to the guy, we forget he had a problem early on, yet he kept 3rd place. He'll be one serious threat if BMW get their act together next year. Another seemling faultless performance. Of course I would like to see a replay of the sector where he lost 4 seconds!

Lewis had a faultless race, but I think ferrari just had more pace here. Still, 2nd was a great solid race, and he only losses 2 points.

Nice back in the points too, that always nice to see. Vettel too is one scary kid, he held onto the back of Kimi and Kovy for a while, but lost out in the end to Truili, which is fair enough. 6th is an amazing result.
Glock too had a great race, being the only one really to make much progress through the field, and was setting some great times mid way. Really, Toyota are coming a big threat. Glock and Truili are too solid plus quick as hell drivers, and Toyota's large budget has at least bought them some points.

As for the track itself, hardly any action. It was like the track was pushing the cars apart most of the time. The field just constantly kept spreading out. The only real overtaking I remember was Nakajima near the end. Seriously, i watched GP2 as well, and hardly anyone could get a tow down those straights. Its only the last corner where overtaking really happened. Which is a pretty odd place.

All in all, it was a quiet race, one of the less exciting this year.

A laughably amateur race for Ferrari. Personally its impossible to think why a whole Ferrari pit team ignored the fact Sutil was coming in alongside and released their man, I'm expecting a penalty for carelessness and the fact that that pit lane is so narrow anything could've happened.

Raikonnen made another amateur mistake in jumping before the green light and in doing so put one of their guys in an appointment with the medics...the arrogance of then not even bothering to explain yourself and simply walking of uncaringly is also hard to comprehend.

Great drive by Lewis, I have high hopes for him, definitely in with a shot at the title.

It's Kimi, what do you expect :p

Hammy mentioned "health issues"...??

I thought it was a bit of a boring race, Alonso retiring was pretty annoying especially for all his fans! I hope Singapore will be more exciting.

The whole Massa thing was a farce, if he was in a McLaren he would have got a penalty!

I think that was a rubbish race, nothing happened racing wise, Kimi just got angry and took it out on someone else!!! there was absolutely no overtaking, the field spread out so fast! and the deal with Massa, the only reason, I THINK, he did not get a penalty because he is challenging Hamilton and they don't want Hamilton running away with it, well that was my view.

I am not happy!! Not a good race in my books!!

No, he got away without a race penalty fairly. Alonso crossed that yellow and red stripes in practive earlier, and got fined. Massa's issue with very similar alonso's. Both were safety stuff, they weren't on purpose, and there was no dangerous inncident involved. So therefore, both got similar punishments which I see as fair.
If massa did loss victory for that, despite doing no harm, and still slowing down and avoiding the inncident, then it would be a complete farce. I mean, its a pathetic reason for someone to lose a race.

First off. The Massa penalty was a bit of a joke, a predictable one, but a joke nonetheless. He breached the rules so a penalty is in order. A fine is not a penalty how ever much you want to say it is. These drivers earn probably double that per race, so i hardly think Massa will loose any sleep over that and Ferrari will probably be laughing to themselves. Fines, in a world sport where the competetors earn millions of pounds a year are a joke. Barring rediculous sums of money like McLarens 50 million euros or whatever it was.

Anywho, apart from that Massa did drive a pretty perfect race. Great start, lead away, kept his cool and dominated the race. Even though im a big Hammy fan, id say its Massa's championship to win this year. Hes on the form of his life, just when it matters most, his teammate struggling, coming up to a few Ferrari tracks, in the closing end of the season.

Hammy. Drove a quiet race, which in a strange way is a good thing for a change. At least hes not in any controversy! But he didnt make any mistakes, kept his head and still showed true pace. His race is telling of his general attitude this year, you can see even in his speaking he is maturing. He was happy today that he knew he couldnt challenge Massa but he kept going, drove well and collected 8 points for his efforts. Its what he needs to do. No one wins championships by going all out every race to try and win at all costs. You win championships by winning when you can, driving consistently and getting points on a consistent basis. Hes learning that, will he win it this year? Im not sure, he can do, he has the talent i have no doubt, but it needs experience and a bit of tactical nous to win it, which McLaren have been lacking lately. If he wins it he will have deserved it, but we will see.

Kimi Raikkonen however, on the past races doesnt deserve to win a raffle, let alone the greatest prize in world motorsport. No lust, no passion, no hunger to win, mediocre driving, ameteur mistakes, doesnt care when he is winning, doesnt care when hes got smoke billowing out the rear of his 2.4 V8, this is not the man who deserves to win the WDC. If he leaves at the end of this year, i will be glad because at least that paves the way for a driver who gives a damn about the sport.

Overall though, a boring race, no overtaking at all, best action was watching Nakajima punt Alonso out on lap 1. Not Alonso's biggest fan so i did have a little smile about that, shame for the fans though i guess. Roll on Spa, hopefully some more action will be in store for us.

That was a very unenjoyable race. Theres just no hope for Kimi :o, whether things are his own fault or bad luck.

I think Massa's fine is the right thing to do, he didn't deserve a proper penalty after what happened to him last race! Plus this situation happens so many times, and nothing is done about it, so I don't see why they were making such a big deal about it this time.

Oh well, well done to Massa, he's putting in some good performances recently. A good result for Kubica in the end too.

Kimi Raikkonen however, on the past races doesnt deserve to win a raffle, let alone the greatest prize in world motorsport. No lust, no passion, no hunger to win, mediocre driving, ameteur mistakes, doesnt care when he is winning, doesnt care when hes got smoke billowing out the rear of his 2.4 V8, this is not the man who deserves to win the WDC. If he leaves at the end of this year, i will be glad because at least that paves the way for a driver who gives a damn about the sport.

I agree with you dude, although I don't think the F1 WDC is the greatest prize n motorsport ;).

*cough* Le Mans 24 Heures *cough*

Anyway but you notice Kimi seems to have no heart since Canada when everyone's main man Lewis hit him in the pits since then he hasn't performed, granted France was a good race but once again bad luck hit him and I think since then he's just lost the 'thrill' of the sport.

So if anybody is too blame its Lewis Hamilton :cool:, just imagine if Lewis didn't hit Kimi in the pits in Canada, Kimi could have won Canada, France and possibly the British GP and the whole season would be alot more exciting than watching Lewis & Massa at it (zzzzzzzzzzzzzz).




(Sorry it had to be said !)

First off. The Massa penalty was a bit of a joke, a predictable one, but a joke nonetheless. He breached the rules so a penalty is in order. A fine is not a penalty how ever much you want to say it is.

This was a team error not Massa, he depends on his team to let him go, and penalizing him with spots or taking away his victory, is not fair, since it was his teams fault.

I mean for that reason, why the hell was Hamilton not stripped from all his points, after the whole world finds out that he KNEW that they where using essentially a Ferrari painted silver.

See same reason, if you believe that Massa should have been declined his podium, you must strongly then believe that Hamilton should have been removed from all his points, and second place last year. Because as you say breaching the rules is breaching the rules.

I agree with you dude, although I don't think the F1 WDC is the greatest prize n motorsport ;).

*cough* Le Mans 24 Heures *cough*

Anyway but you notice Kimi seems to have no heart since Canada when everyone's main man Lewis hit him in the pits since then he hasn't performed, granted France was a good race but once again bad luck hit him and I think since then he's just lost the 'thrill' of the sport.

So if anybody is too blame its Lewis Hamilton :cool:, just imagine if Lewis didn't hit Kimi in the pits in Canada, Kimi could have won Canada, France and possibly the British GP and the whole season would be alot more exciting than watching Lewis & Massa at it (zzzzzzzzzzzzzz).




(Sorry it had to be said !)

So basically, your main man Kimi has gotten his panties in a twist because he had a bit of bad luck. Boo hoo. Get over it. Look at Mark Webber, hes had far worse things happen, and you dont see him crying over it!!

If Ferrari learn nothing from this weekend its a tragedy. They need to put all their effort behind Massa, if they dont then all it will do is mean they are less well equiped to deal with Hamilton. Kimi doesnt have the desire of Massa, he is consistently outqualified by his brazillian teammate, he never drives with any hunger anymore and his passion for the sport has evaporated completely like you said, since Canada.

So basically, your main man Kimi has gotten his panties in a twist because he had a bit of bad luck. Boo hoo. Get over it. Look at Mark Webber, hes had far worse things happen, and you dont see him crying over it!!

If Ferrari learn nothing from this weekend its a tragedy. They need to put all their effort behind Massa, if they dont then all it will do is mean they are less well equiped to deal with Hamilton. Kimi doesnt have the desire of Massa, he is consistently outqualified by his brazillian teammate, he never drives with any hunger anymore and his passion for the sport has evaporated completely like you said, since Canada.

I won't argue if Ferrari choose Massa, Massa at the moment is better than Kimi and Ferrari would be dumb if they choose Kimi over Massa to fight for the WDC.

I dunno what to think about his recent performances, although I have a funny feeling he might leave F1 because appearantly he has been approached by the Ford WRC team to test their car and if all goes well I think we might see Kimi leave F1 and goto the WRC.

Frankly the WRC needs a big named driver like Kimi to inject some much needed publicity there way because WRC is boring, hell I only recognise one driver and thats Sebastian Loeb and thats only because he was in it years ago when it had decent coverage.

Although I don't know if his laid back style would suit rallying :-k .......

This was a team error not Massa, he depends on his team to let him go, and penalizing him with spots or taking away his victory, is not fair, since it was his teams fault.

I mean for that reason, why the hell was Hamilton not stripped from all his points, after the whole world finds out that he KNEW that they where using essentially a Ferrari painted silver.

See same reason, if you believe that Massa should have been declined his podium, you must strongly then believe that Hamilton should have been removed from all his points, and second place last year. Because as you say breaching the rules is breaching the rules.

Its a team thing yes, but you win as a team you loose as a team, they let him go early, but its still the driver in controll. Its the cheif mechanics fault still, but its not Massa and Ferrari, they are one, if one person makes a mistake they all should be punished as a team. I never said what the punishment should be, i never once said he should be stripped of his points or his win, i believe a 5 place grid drop at the next GP would have been more than enough.

Oh please, let it go, a few employees (all 1 of them knew in full) had technical data of Ferrari's, Alonso and De la Rosa tested a set-up similar to Ferrari's (like EVERYONE does, you see something, you try and figure it out and use it yourself). Hamilton didnt know about it. No Ferrari parts or data made it into their car, for the last time, it was not a Ferrari painted silver. Just drop it.

Again, i never said he should be declined his podium, he won it fair and square, he should keep it. I just said 10,000 euro fines to a driver who is on a few million per year is pointless. They wont even remember it 2 races down the line. Hamilton didnt know about the Ferrari info, the guy who did was sacked and McLaren was fined 500,000,000 dollars, which like i said is a different matter because while small fines are pointless, huge fines actually do something. They were also stripped of ALL their constructors points, because its a team sport, the drivers didnt do anything directly wrong so the drivers points were inaffected.

I am not a steward so i dont know what punishment would have been fair, but a few thousand euro fine is just pointless, they wont learn from it, you might aswell not bother doing anything.

The incident with Massa and Sutil happens so many times in F1, or other races, and I believe this is the first time I've heard somebody got a penalty for it.

I hope Massa can keep this pace for the rest of the season, there's nobody who could stop him this and last race. Apart from a blown up engine ofcourse. That should keep the championship title in Maranello.:)

The incident with Massa and Sutil happens so many times in F1, or other races, and I believe this is the first time I've heard somebody got a penalty for it.

I hope Massa can keep this pace for the rest of the season, there's nobody who could stop him this and last race. Apart from a blown up engine ofcourse. That should keep the championship title in Maranello.:)

Somebody got a penalty in GP2 the day earlier for the same thing. Its happened before in F1 and other motorsport series'. The stewards have just been cracking down on this kind of thing lately, hence Alonso's penalty for something daft in friday practice.

The problem is, blown up engines is getting to be a little problem for the red crew, so it might be the thing that gives the title to the guys in Woking.

Something tells me somebody already sleeps with a horses head in his bed, and others are working their asses of to make sure we see no more white smoke behind the Ferrari's. :p

Hopefully, Kimi can pull himself together and start acting like a real,
World Champion!! As for Massa and his episode in pitlane, when I was
first learning to drive, my parents over and over again, look before you
enter into traffic or change lanes. It seems to me if Massa had checked
his rear view mirrors, he would have seen Sutil coming and thus his "near miss" with Sutil could have been avoided.

As someone who slammed street courses; I have to say Valencia was a decent track. Too bad it was a lamer race. 1-2-3 as they qualified.

I should be a bookie to take bets from you guys...

Don't talk to me about stewards/officials. I'm about ready to vote to hang/draw/quarter anybody in a wearing a suit at any race!

I agree with you dude, although I don't think the F1 WDC is the greatest prize n motorsport ;).

*cough* Le Mans 24 Heures *cough*

Anyway but you notice Kimi seems to have no heart since Canada when everyone's main man Lewis hit him in the pits since then he hasn't performed, granted France was a good race but once again bad luck hit him and I think since then he's just lost the 'thrill' of the sport.

So if anybody is too blame its Lewis Hamilton :cool:, just imagine if Lewis didn't hit Kimi in the pits in Canada, Kimi could have won Canada, France and possibly the British GP and the whole season would be alot more exciting than watching Lewis & Massa at it (zzzzzzzzzzzzzz).




(Sorry it had to be said !)

Just imagine if Raikonnen didn't hit Sutil in Monaco. Sutil would've come 4th which would've been a huge boost for the whole of Force India in terms of points and morale. It works both ways, to blame another driver for someones complete disregard of any passion for a sport is just plain weird.

Yes, well imagine if Massa never broke down in Hungary, he would now lead the championship.

But imagine Lewis never crashed in Monaco, and wasn't able to leap Felipe and Kubica without effort, and we saw Kubica actually win. Or imagine mclaren never got a penalty in malaysia, or if ferrari never broke down in melbourne, or even if Lewis never hit the back of Alonso in Bahrain, or if Lewis didn't hit Kimi on montreal, and didn't get a penalty in france.
And what of Kovalinen, what if he never got hit by Kimi in turkey, or if he never crashed in spain or if his car never stalled in monaco, or if he never got a ridiculous penalty in france. Would he be closer to the top.

As you can see, there are tonnes of what if's from this season. So really, its hard to argue when really, everyones had their fair share of bad luck.

Its pointless saying "well if this happened then...." because it didnt. So you can speculate all you want, i could say what if Senna hadnt have crashed, or if Schumi had never have gone to Ferrari, or if the motor car had never been invented, its all just as pointless!

But like sonicadg said, everyone has had bad luck, no one has had nothing bad happen, thats racing, bad things happen, its how you deal with it and overcome your problems, the best drivers recover better, thats why when Massa's engine broke agonisingly close to winning, he came back next race and dominated it from start to finish, thats what the best drivers do. Unfortunately, Kimi hasnt shown this at all, he has massive lackluster periods and this year i think it will cost him the championship, it will go to his teammate.

Its pointless saying "well if this happened then...." because it didnt. So you can speculate all you want, i could say what if Senna hadnt have crashed, or if Schumi had never have gone to Ferrari, or if the motor car had never been invented, its all just as pointless!

But like sonicadg said, everyone has had bad luck, no one has had nothing bad happen, thats racing, bad things happen, its how you deal with it and overcome your problems, the best drivers recover better, thats why when Massa's engine broke agonisingly close to winning, he came back next race and dominated it from start to finish, thats what the best drivers do. Unfortunately, Kimi hasnt shown this at all, he has massive lackluster periods and this year i think it will cost him the championship, it will go to his teammate.


wow are you turning over the ferrari side??? hmm I think hell might be freezing just about now.

Oh god no, dont worry, im still a big Hammy fan, i just believe that Massa will pip Hamilton to the title this year. Massa is in the form of his life and with some big Ferrari tracks coming up i dont think Hammy will be able to out-do the Brazilian untill the end of the year.

Still rooting for the Brit though!!! :D

I found this on Ebay Motors at Ebay.com
Michael Schumachers 1994 Benetton B-194-08:
This is the genuine car raced by Michael Schumacher in 1994. This
is the car most remembered for the incident at Adelaide with his
"coming together" with Damon Hill and effectively winning his First
World Championship. The car is in concourse condition, with original
paint. Has the correct 3.5 Cosworth Zeteck air-valve V8 engine.
The car also comes with a "Certificate Of Authenticity" the asking
price a mere $500.000 dollars.

^$500,000? Seems awfully cheap for a car that Michael Schumacher raced, lol. Also, a 1994 Benetton, very cheap.

Anyway, lucky lucky person is all I have to say to the person who gets this car!

I've been to a bunch of auctions where there well old F1 cars for sale...

I never found them outrageously expensive (I mean, it's a lot, but you'd think more). I guess we don't realize but they probably made a sh*t load of these cars... Think about it, each team brings about 3 or 4 cars to EACH race. Then let's say they have a 5th for promotional purposes or testing whatever.

Everyone one or two races, there is 4 whole new cars (I might be way off on this one but I'm pretty certain to change and build new cars a lot). And there's what... 10 or 12 teams?

Take the 90's era alone, and that's a LOT of Formula One Cars.

I've been to a bunch of auctions where there well old F1 cars for sale...

I never found them outrageously expensive (I mean, it's a lot, but you'd think more). I guess we don't realize but they probably made a sh*t load of these cars... Think about it, each team brings about 3 or 4 cars to EACH race. Then let's say they have a 5th for promotional purposes or testing whatever.

Everyone one or two races, there is 4 whole new cars (I might be way off on this one but I'm pretty certain to change and build new cars a lot). And there's what... 10 or 12 teams?

Take the 90's era alone, and that's a LOT of Formula One Cars.

I think you are mistaken, unless they are involved in a very heavy shunt, F1 teams make 4 chassis (might be only 3, im not sure) to which the body parts, suspension, engine etc is mounted, these last an entire season unless they are broken in a crash. All thats usually replaced is parts such as the nose cone, rear wing or any modified aero parts. They dont have 4 whole cars at each race, they have 2, with back-up parts such as wings, wheels, suspension, gearboxes etc. Im not even sure if they bring a backup car anymore, Ferrari and McLaren might still do it but the lower teams i dont think do.

The reason they dont make lots is simple, it takes mind boggling amounts of money to make them, £25,000 for a rear wing £12,000 for a front wing (think about how many front wings get knocked in a season) i cant remember many other things but even things like the wheel nuts cost £5,000 each, these are the small things, not even things like the engine which i would imagine is in the reigon of around 200,000 pounds. Gearbox casings are about £50,000, thats without the gears, just the casing. Its monopoly money to build these things, so they are not going to make any more than they absolutely have to. Also, it takes a hell of a lot of time to make these things.

I agree with Beaver on the chassis and parts of the F1 cars per race.
According to FIA Regulations the engines now have to last for two
races. Each team has to use each tire compound (soft, hard) in each
race as well.